Comment after "Why does God allow suffering?"
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COMMENT:
"I do not think that Adam and Eve were aware of satan, to be able to 'choose' him as their father. I believe Jesus' blood can cover everyone. Eve definitely glorified God after her births, but yes, they could not remain there with sins uncovered, so they were cast out of Eden and lived many years after. Eve was unaware of who the snake really was.
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My response:
The scriptures help to clarify for us, the issues you raise. Were Adam and Eve, aware of Satan?
Gen.3:1-4 describes the conversation Eve had with the serpent. Afterward, God asked Eve;
"13 And the Lord God said to the woman, “What is this you have done?”
The woman said, “The serpent deceived me, and I ate.” (Gen.3:13)
Even though the serpent is symbolic for Satan (Rev.12:9), and the fruit he offered was symbolic for his guidance (Luke 6:44-45), the conversation between Satan and Eve is evident.
For more clarity about what happened in Eden, the scriptures in this post are helpful:
https://
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The Bible speaks of those who have Satan as their father.
It is not because they make that a conscious choice, but because they imitate and resemble him...
"44 You belong to your father, the devil, and you want to carry out your father’s desires. He was a murderer from the beginning, not holding to the truth, for there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks his native language, for he is a liar and the father of lies." (John8)
---Jesus said this about the Jews, while the Jews claimed and believed themselves to be, God's true children (John8:41). Jesus responded to them, with John8:44.
Matt.13:
"38 The field is the world, and the good seed stands for the sons of the kingdom. The weeds are the sons of the evil one, 39 and the enemy who sows them is the devil."
1John3:
"10 By this the children of God are distinguished from the children of the devil: Anyone who does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor is anyone who does not love his brother."
At Matt.3:7 John the Baptist spoke of the generation of vipers. Jesus agreed (Matt.23:33-34,35-36,37-38).
God Himself referred to that generation of the Devil,
at Gen.3:15...
"And I will put enmity between thee (the Devil) and the woman, and between your seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel."
There is an ongoing battle between the seed of Satan and the seed of the covenant woman (Gal.4:26).
(https://pearl-thewoman.blogspot.com/)
As Jesus said in Matt.13:30,39, they both "grow together" until the time of the harvest.
The seed/children of the Devil, do not choose to be so consciously. They are categorized as such, by their word and deeds.
Their choices in life make evident, who they are imitating, and who their father is.
-
This is also true of becoming God's children...
"Become imitators of God, therefore, as beloved children" (Eph.5:1).
Matthew 5:48
"Be perfect, therefore, as your Heavenly Father is perfect."
Luke 6:36
"Be merciful, just as your Father is merciful."
John8:42
"Jesus said to them, ‘If God were your Father, you would love me, for I have come here from God. I have not come on my own; God sent me."
-
Whoever we bear the spiritual traits of,
is our spiritual father.
- - - -
Regarding a ransom for Adam and Eve....
Jesus himself mentioned dying for his friends...
John15: "9 ‘As the Father has loved me, so have I loved you. Now remain in my love. 10 If you keep my commands, you will remain in my love, just as I have kept my Father’s commands and remain in his love. 13 Greater love has no one than this: to lay down one’s life for one’s friends. 14 You are my friends if you do what I command."
-
We see there that the love of Jesus is conditional upon obedience. At John 15:13-14, Jesus explains that he lays down his life for his friends. That friendship is also conditional, upon obedience.
The Lamb of God has a book of life.
The disobedient are not written in it (Ps.69:28; Rev.13:8)(Revelation 20:12,15; 21:27; 3:5).
Even though Adam and Eve's son Abel did not have the ransom of Jesus... he did not choose the Devil as his father, because he sought the approval of God (Gen.4:4). Despite not yet having the ransom, Jesus considered Abel a righteous martyr, and said of him...
"And so upon you (the offspring of vipers) will come all the righteous blood that has been shed on earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah son of Berekiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar." (Matt.23:35)
Heb.12: "24 to Jesus the mediator of a new covenant, and to the sprinkled blood that speaks a better word than the blood of Abel."
....So, Abel was ascribed righteousness. He died as the first righteous man. That too, was no accident. He manifested by his actions, who he desired to imitate.
-
So you see,
we can have many of our own thoughts about what is true. But if we really want the truth,
we have to turn to the Word of God (Rom.3:4; John17:17)
Gen.3:1-4 describes the conversation Eve had with the serpent. Afterward, God asked Eve;
"13 And the Lord God said to the woman, “What is this you have done?”
The woman said, “The serpent deceived me, and I ate.” (Gen.3:13)
Even though the serpent is symbolic for Satan (Rev.12:9), and the fruit he offered was symbolic for his guidance (Luke 6:44-45), the conversation between Satan and Eve is evident.
For more clarity about what happened in Eden, the scriptures in this post are helpful:
https://
-
The Bible speaks of those who have Satan as their father.
It is not because they make that a conscious choice, but because they imitate and resemble him...
"44 You belong to your father, the devil, and you want to carry out your father’s desires. He was a murderer from the beginning, not holding to the truth, for there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks his native language, for he is a liar and the father of lies." (John8)
---Jesus said this about the Jews, while the Jews claimed and believed themselves to be, God's true children (John8:41). Jesus responded to them, with John8:44.
Matt.13:
"38 The field is the world, and the good seed stands for the sons of the kingdom. The weeds are the sons of the evil one, 39 and the enemy who sows them is the devil."
1John3:
"10 By this the children of God are distinguished from the children of the devil: Anyone who does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor is anyone who does not love his brother."
At Matt.3:7 John the Baptist spoke of the generation of vipers. Jesus agreed (Matt.23:33-34,35-36,37-38).
God Himself referred to that generation of the Devil,
at Gen.3:15...
"And I will put enmity between thee (the Devil) and the woman, and between your seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel."
There is an ongoing battle between the seed of Satan and the seed of the covenant woman (Gal.4:26).
(https://pearl-thewoman.blogspot.com/)
As Jesus said in Matt.13:30,39, they both "grow together" until the time of the harvest.
The seed/children of the Devil, do not choose to be so consciously. They are categorized as such, by their word and deeds.
Their choices in life make evident, who they are imitating, and who their father is.
-
This is also true of becoming God's children...
"Become imitators of God, therefore, as beloved children" (Eph.5:1).
Matthew 5:48
"Be perfect, therefore, as your Heavenly Father is perfect."
Luke 6:36
"Be merciful, just as your Father is merciful."
John8:42
"Jesus said to them, ‘If God were your Father, you would love me, for I have come here from God. I have not come on my own; God sent me."
-
Whoever we bear the spiritual traits of,
is our spiritual father.
- - - -
Regarding a ransom for Adam and Eve....
Jesus himself mentioned dying for his friends...
John15: "9 ‘As the Father has loved me, so have I loved you. Now remain in my love. 10 If you keep my commands, you will remain in my love, just as I have kept my Father’s commands and remain in his love. 13 Greater love has no one than this: to lay down one’s life for one’s friends. 14 You are my friends if you do what I command."
-
We see there that the love of Jesus is conditional upon obedience. At John 15:13-14, Jesus explains that he lays down his life for his friends. That friendship is also conditional, upon obedience.
The Lamb of God has a book of life.
The disobedient are not written in it (Ps.69:28; Rev.13:8)(Revelation 20:12,15; 21:27; 3:5).
Even though Adam and Eve's son Abel did not have the ransom of Jesus... he did not choose the Devil as his father, because he sought the approval of God (Gen.4:4). Despite not yet having the ransom, Jesus considered Abel a righteous martyr, and said of him...
"And so upon you (the offspring of vipers) will come all the righteous blood that has been shed on earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah son of Berekiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar." (Matt.23:35)
Heb.12: "24 to Jesus the mediator of a new covenant, and to the sprinkled blood that speaks a better word than the blood of Abel."
....So, Abel was ascribed righteousness. He died as the first righteous man. That too, was no accident. He manifested by his actions, who he desired to imitate.
-
So you see,
we can have many of our own thoughts about what is true. But if we really want the truth,
we have to turn to the Word of God (Rom.3:4; John17:17)
---------------
Additional comment:
Eve was unaware of who the snake really was.
-----------------
My Response:
But Eve was aware of God's warning, and the consequences (Gen.2:16-17; 3:2-3). Her sin was established by her own defiance (Gen.3:6), not by a full familiarity with her tempter. Few of humankind, have a full familiarity with Satan. That does not prevent them from imitating Satan's evil traits, or unwittingly choosing him for their father. Despite their loss of spiritual acuity (2Cor.4:4; John3:19; Matt.6:23; John12:35);
the spirit which they generated and cultivated inside them (Matt.15:18-19),
binds them as guilty before the judgment seat of God (Jer.17:10; Heb.4:13).
the spirit which they generated and cultivated inside them (Matt.15:18-19),
binds them as guilty before the judgment seat of God (Jer.17:10; Heb.4:13).
Regarding the initial comment, I remember when we were discussing something similar with someone on a fb group. That person also felt that Jesus’ sacrifice covered Adam and Eve’s sin. One of the scriptures that you had mentioned was Hos 6:7
ReplyDelete“And they, as Adam, transgressed a covenant, There they dealt treacherously against me.” Adam and Eve had already been gifted with eternal life, but by breaking this life-giving covenant, they received what God further promised, eternal death. Gen 3:2,3
Your scripture in Jer 17:10 helps us understand the basis of God’s judgments. “I, the LORD, examine the mind, I test the heart to give to each according to his way, according to what his actions deserve.”
Thank you for bringing up Hosea 6:7. The point it makes is crucial. I didn't find the rest of this interchange with the one who commented. I'm sure I left out some of the good scriptures that were cited. I need to transfer such things over to this blog more quickly and efficiently. But I often lose track when I am working on too much as once :)
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