A QUESTION:
Hello again Pearl,
I hope you don't mind me writing to you again so soon but I wanted to ask you your thoughts on Romans 9:25 to see if I am understanding this correctly?
Concerning the Gentiles, God says in the prophecy of Hosea, "Those who were not my people, I will now call my people. And I will love those whom I did not love before. And, Then, at the place where they were told, 'You are not my people,' there they will be called 'children of the living God."
Could this be saying that those who have been disfellowshipped, who have faded, stopped their association with the organization due to seeing through the lie, those who have been spiritually killed, those who have independently sought out Christ for themselves & do not submit to men, could it be that these are known as now not being God's people as far as the by organization are concerned, but in fact it is actually these ones who now being called "His people" by God Himself?
--------------
My Reply:
God's people are defined at 1Pet. 2:9-10....
"But you are a chosen race, a royal priesthood,
a holy nation, a people for His possession,
so that you may proclaim the praises
of the One who called you out of darkness
into His marvelous light.
Once you were not a people,
but now you are God’s people;
you had not received mercy,
but now you have received mercy."
God's covenant with them, is His light in their heart (Jer.31:33), rather than "on tablets of stone" (Heb.8:8-10; Deut.11:18; Rev.14:1), as was the first covenant with the physical Jews (Ex.24:12; 2Cor. 3:2,3,6,7,8).
The physical Gentiles that are taken by God, into that new covenant within their hearts (through circumcision "by the holy spirit" Rom.2:29; 7:6; Phil.3:3; Col.2:11), are then considered God's people, or, considered "Jews" in a spiritual sense (Rom.2:28-29; Gal.6:15; 2Cor. 5:17), because the spiritual "Israel of God" (Gal.6:16; Rom.9:6,8), is no longer based on one's flesh/physical lineage (Matt.3:9; Gal.3:26-29; Matt.3:11; 1Cor. 12:13).
The new "Israel of God", is a single flock of spiritual Jews, (whether they are physical Jew or physical Gentile) (anointed-flock) (Eph.2:15; John 10:16; Rev.5:9-10). (Jew-Gentile)
After taking physical Gentiles into the new covenant, and making them spiritual Jews,
spiritual Gentiles (who are not God's people), still exist.
Those are referred to at Rev.3:9; and Rev.11:2 are not anointed. Those Gentiles assume "they are Jews", (in that they believe they are also God's chosen people), and that they also have a right to serve God in His temple as the priests do.
No one has a right to serve in the Temple, unless they are a priest and have had the circumcision of the heart/have been consecrated by Christ (2Chron. 23:6; Eze.44:6-9; Col.2:11; 1Pet. 2:5) Then their Temple sacrifice, is "acceptable" to God.
When spiritual Gentiles do assume priestly duties, that is "the disgusting thing (uncircumcised/uncleansed/unconsecrated -Acts 7:51,53) standing (ruling/presiding over) in the holy place" (God's genuine temple -1Cor. 3:16-17) (Matt.24:15; Rev.11:2; 2Thess. 2:4).
--(pearl-disgustingthing.blogspot.com)
Hello again Pearl,
I hope you don't mind me writing to you again so soon but I wanted to ask you your thoughts on Romans 9:25 to see if I am understanding this correctly?
Concerning the Gentiles, God says in the prophecy of Hosea, "Those who were not my people, I will now call my people. And I will love those whom I did not love before. And, Then, at the place where they were told, 'You are not my people,' there they will be called 'children of the living God."
Could this be saying that those who have been disfellowshipped, who have faded, stopped their association with the organization due to seeing through the lie, those who have been spiritually killed, those who have independently sought out Christ for themselves & do not submit to men, could it be that these are known as now not being God's people as far as the by organization are concerned, but in fact it is actually these ones who now being called "His people" by God Himself?
--------------
My Reply:
God's people are defined at 1Pet. 2:9-10....
"But you are a chosen race, a royal priesthood,
a holy nation, a people for His possession,
so that you may proclaim the praises
of the One who called you out of darkness
into His marvelous light.
Once you were not a people,
but now you are God’s people;
you had not received mercy,
but now you have received mercy."
God's covenant with them, is His light in their heart (Jer.31:33), rather than "on tablets of stone" (Heb.8:8-10; Deut.11:18; Rev.14:1), as was the first covenant with the physical Jews (Ex.24:12; 2Cor. 3:2,3,6,7,8).
The physical Gentiles that are taken by God, into that new covenant within their hearts (through circumcision "by the holy spirit" Rom.2:29; 7:6; Phil.3:3; Col.2:11), are then considered God's people, or, considered "Jews" in a spiritual sense (Rom.2:28-29; Gal.6:15; 2Cor. 5:17), because the spiritual "Israel of God" (Gal.6:16; Rom.9:6,8), is no longer based on one's flesh/physical lineage (Matt.3:9; Gal.3:26-29; Matt.3:11; 1Cor. 12:13).
The new "Israel of God", is a single flock of spiritual Jews, (whether they are physical Jew or physical Gentile) (anointed-flock) (Eph.2:15; John 10:16; Rev.5:9-10). (Jew-Gentile)
After taking physical Gentiles into the new covenant, and making them spiritual Jews,
spiritual Gentiles (who are not God's people), still exist.
Those are referred to at Rev.3:9; and Rev.11:2 are not anointed. Those Gentiles assume "they are Jews", (in that they believe they are also God's chosen people), and that they also have a right to serve God in His temple as the priests do.
No one has a right to serve in the Temple, unless they are a priest and have had the circumcision of the heart/have been consecrated by Christ (2Chron. 23:6; Eze.44:6-9; Col.2:11; 1Pet. 2:5) Then their Temple sacrifice, is "acceptable" to God.
When spiritual Gentiles do assume priestly duties, that is "the disgusting thing (uncircumcised/uncleansed/unconsecrated -Acts 7:51,53) standing (ruling/presiding over) in the holy place" (God's genuine temple -1Cor. 3:16-17) (Matt.24:15; Rev.11:2; 2Thess. 2:4).
--(pearl-disgustingthing.blogspot.com)
----(https://4womaninthewilderness.blogspot.com/2013/09/trample-how-does-it-happen.html)
For more insight on Rom.9:25, consider the context (verses 23-26)...
"And what if He did this to make known the riches of His glory on objects of mercy (1Pet. 2:10) that He prepared beforehand for glory— 24 on us, the ones He also called, not only from the Jews but also from the Gentiles? 25 As He also says in Hosea:
I will call Not My People, My People,
and she who is Unloved, Beloved.
26 And it will be in the place where they were told,
you are not My people,
there they will be called sons of the living God."
God has called (and shown mercy -1Pet. 2:10; Rom.9:23) to people from among physical Gentiles, to become His "Jewish" sons of Abraham (Gal.3:29,26).
Not sure how or why verse 25 leads you to conclude...
"those who have been disfellowshipped, who have faded, stopped their association with the organization due to seeing through the lie, those who have been spiritually killed, those who have independently sought out Christ for themselves & do not submit to men, could it be that these are known as now not being God's people as far as the by organization are concerned, but in fact it is actually these ones who now being called "His people" by God Himself?"
No. I see no reason to consider all those who have left the WT, to be God's people.
God does not describe his new covenant people, as all those who have left the WT. Christ described in parable, all those who have left the WT, as "all those leaving the City" (see: Matt.22:9). These are not said to become God's sons, but are only said to receive an invitation to the marriage feast.
For more insight on Rom.9:25, consider the context (verses 23-26)...
"And what if He did this to make known the riches of His glory on objects of mercy (1Pet. 2:10) that He prepared beforehand for glory— 24 on us, the ones He also called, not only from the Jews but also from the Gentiles? 25 As He also says in Hosea:
I will call Not My People, My People,
and she who is Unloved, Beloved.
26 And it will be in the place where they were told,
you are not My people,
there they will be called sons of the living God."
God has called (and shown mercy -1Pet. 2:10; Rom.9:23) to people from among physical Gentiles, to become His "Jewish" sons of Abraham (Gal.3:29,26).
Not sure how or why verse 25 leads you to conclude...
"those who have been disfellowshipped, who have faded, stopped their association with the organization due to seeing through the lie, those who have been spiritually killed, those who have independently sought out Christ for themselves & do not submit to men, could it be that these are known as now not being God's people as far as the by organization are concerned, but in fact it is actually these ones who now being called "His people" by God Himself?"
No. I see no reason to consider all those who have left the WT, to be God's people.
God does not describe his new covenant people, as all those who have left the WT. Christ described in parable, all those who have left the WT, as "all those leaving the City" (see: Matt.22:9). These are not said to become God's sons, but are only said to receive an invitation to the marriage feast.
Surely you have examined the comments from thousands on forums, who have left the WT for becoming disillusioned. Generally, they certainly do not have God's Laws written on their hearts by Holy Spirit. Most have lost their faith in God (James 1:6; Luke 21:25; Isa.57:20; Eze.34:18-19)... even doubting the existence of God's genuine Temple priesthood (Eze.34:19; Eze.32:13,14; Ps.23:2; Rev.4:6; 22:17). The rest are drowning in those cloudy waters... spiritual confusion and conflicting opinions, which is the hallmark of those under "Babylon" the Great ("Babylon" means "confusion" -Gen.11:7, 9).
Although prophecy acknowledges they search for truth outside WT walls (Dan.12:4,10), their lack of humility or submission to God's Temple priests (Mal.2:7; 1Pet. 2:9), causes them to search in vain (Amos 8:11-12; 2Tim. 3:7; Mark 4:11-12).
Those who "wander from sea to sea" are not those in the WT. Those in the WT are captive to one source of food (Rev.13:17; 6:6).
Few even recognize God's genuine temple anymore, nor his priesthood of anointed, and even doubt their existence. They have allowed the gov. bdy. to jade their minds regarding such Bible concepts.
These many have, "independently sought out Christ for themselves"... independent of the WT... but for most, their independence extends toward turning away from Gods true Temple, as well. They are therefore, just as rebellious and darkened, as the WT.
There is no salvation nor reconciliation with God, without accepting the existence of his genuine temple (Eph.2:20-22; John 13:20; 17:18; Luke 10:16; Hab.2:3; Amos 3:7; Rev.11:3; 22:6-7), where God's spirit and truth, resides and is cultivated (1Cor. 3:16,8-9; John 4:22; Rom.2:28-29)(Zech.8:23). Remember... that is where God's laws of light have been written... within the hearts and minds of his sons/priests (1Pet. 2:9-10; Heb.8:10).
Although prophecy acknowledges they search for truth outside WT walls (Dan.12:4,10), their lack of humility or submission to God's Temple priests (Mal.2:7; 1Pet. 2:9), causes them to search in vain (Amos 8:11-12; 2Tim. 3:7; Mark 4:11-12).
Those who "wander from sea to sea" are not those in the WT. Those in the WT are captive to one source of food (Rev.13:17; 6:6).
Few even recognize God's genuine temple anymore, nor his priesthood of anointed, and even doubt their existence. They have allowed the gov. bdy. to jade their minds regarding such Bible concepts.
These many have, "independently sought out Christ for themselves"... independent of the WT... but for most, their independence extends toward turning away from Gods true Temple, as well. They are therefore, just as rebellious and darkened, as the WT.
There is no salvation nor reconciliation with God, without accepting the existence of his genuine temple (Eph.2:20-22; John 13:20; 17:18; Luke 10:16; Hab.2:3; Amos 3:7; Rev.11:3; 22:6-7), where God's spirit and truth, resides and is cultivated (1Cor. 3:16,8-9; John 4:22; Rom.2:28-29)(Zech.8:23). Remember... that is where God's laws of light have been written... within the hearts and minds of his sons/priests (1Pet. 2:9-10; Heb.8:10).
Only these spirit-circumcised priests, are Christ's ambassadors of truth, light, and life (2Cor. 5:20). The genuine are either received,
or rejected, along with the waters of life which they offer to all (Rev.22:17; 2Cor. 2:15-16; 3:5-6). Their authenticity can be discerned, by using the standards Christ set forth (Matt.7:20; John 7:17-18; 16:13; Rev.22:6) ("Who are the "fine trees"?)
Rom.9:25 is a quote from Hosea 2:23. That entire chapter of Hosea is relevant to your question, as to who become God's people. I hope to write up a verse by verse examination of that chapter; but if you read it, I'm sure you will recognize many of it's verses as applying, today.
(Hosea chapter 2)
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or rejected, along with the waters of life which they offer to all (Rev.22:17; 2Cor. 2:15-16; 3:5-6). Their authenticity can be discerned, by using the standards Christ set forth (Matt.7:20; John 7:17-18; 16:13; Rev.22:6) ("Who are the "fine trees"?)
Even though the description you have given does not constitute God's people...
God's faithful people do fulfill some of the choices and deeds which you have listed.
Be assured that those who confess Christ though faced with the WT "death", will be acknowledged by Christ before God (Matt.10:32 and Luke 12:8) (Mark 8:35).
This does not include those who "fade" or "disassociate", because they fail to give the essential witness to all possible, before their "death". Christ did not "fade" or write a letter of disassociation from the synagogue (1Pet. 2:21; Eph.4:25; 5:11; Matt.10:32; Mark 8:35; Heb.13:13-16). He publicly preached the truth to the greatest extent possible, and was killed for that (Rom.6:5). When we "confess Christ", we are endorsing his example, by imitating him in his being "the faithful and true witness" (Rev.3:14). If we are not endorsing Christ's example by exposing deceptive doctrine to those held captive (Luke 4:18,21), we are not a genuine Christian (Luke 6:40; 1Pet. 2:21).
Just as Zech.8:23 stated, if those leaving the WT, "grab hold" of a living stone (1Pet. 2:5)... they also will live (Matt.10:41).
Be assured that those who confess Christ though faced with the WT "death", will be acknowledged by Christ before God (Matt.10:32 and Luke 12:8) (Mark 8:35).
This does not include those who "fade" or "disassociate", because they fail to give the essential witness to all possible, before their "death". Christ did not "fade" or write a letter of disassociation from the synagogue (1Pet. 2:21; Eph.4:25; 5:11; Matt.10:32; Mark 8:35; Heb.13:13-16). He publicly preached the truth to the greatest extent possible, and was killed for that (Rom.6:5). When we "confess Christ", we are endorsing his example, by imitating him in his being "the faithful and true witness" (Rev.3:14). If we are not endorsing Christ's example by exposing deceptive doctrine to those held captive (Luke 4:18,21), we are not a genuine Christian (Luke 6:40; 1Pet. 2:21).
Just as Zech.8:23 stated, if those leaving the WT, "grab hold" of a living stone (1Pet. 2:5)... they also will live (Matt.10:41).
Here are some past posts that may help to clarify:
Rom.9:25 is a quote from Hosea 2:23. That entire chapter of Hosea is relevant to your question, as to who become God's people. I hope to write up a verse by verse examination of that chapter; but if you read it, I'm sure you will recognize many of it's verses as applying, today.
(Hosea chapter 2)
LINK TO MAIN HOME-PAGE
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